Rory Sabatini...what a wienie!

[golfn00b]

Play by the rules, talk to your playing partner?  Just for starters?

Now me being me, if I was the guy who did pairings?  I'd pair them together from now onw on Thursday and Friday.

  Haha, that made my day.

[DaveT319]

I agree that Crane was waaay too slow.  However, the group had been put on and off the clock during the day AND they were not on the clock when Rory walked off.   And if he was doing it too show Crane a lesson, why wait till towards the end of the round?  One reason - he's a jerk.

He waited to the end of the round because that's when he couldn't take it anymore. He tried to be polite, he tried to put up with it for most of the round. But there's only so much a person can take, and apparently that's when Rory reached his limit.

The reason I'm defending him and feel what he did was ok is because in an amateur event last year, one of the guys in my 4-some during qualifying was so slow that we got put on the clock, and told if we didn't speed up it would be a 2-stroke penalty for the whole group, and after that we'd be DQ'ed. He sped up - until right after the official told us that we had caught up and were off the clock. Then he slowed down again. The three of us were pissed that he could potentially cost us a spot in the tournament, and kept trying to push him along. And in talking with other since then, they have all complained about this guy. If I'd have had the balls Rory had, I would have done the same thing.

Just because these guys are playing for a lot of money doesn't mean that they need to take 5 minutes deciding how to play their next shot, and then another 30 seconds over that ball. Get your distance, decide on the shot, and pull the trigger. Slow play is inexcusable.

Dave

[abraves10]

Play by the rules, talk to your playing partner?  Just for starters?

Now me being me, if I was the guy who did pairings?  I'd pair them together from now onw on Thursday and Friday.

What rule did he break?  Crane wouldnt be able to compete in the average HS match because he is so slow, I think Rory's method was effective maybe a bit rude but not uncalled for.

[Jaw2000]

I believe there is a rule that partners must witness each shot taken so that they can attest scores.  He did not do this did he?


Did he hole out and leave for the next tee?

And did he do so after they were no longer on the clock?

I am not defending Crane - in fact I have not done so even once - but as I said, there is a right way to do this and showing up your partner - while certainly entertaining, was not proper, right, sporting nor anything good at all.

It was just another form of look at me grandstanding.  And Rory DOES have a record of that - see the camo pants that the tour had to ask him to stop wearing.

Rory + balls = weenie.

[abraves10]

I believe there is a rule that partners must witness each shot taken so that they can attest scores.  He did not do this did he?


Did he hole out and leave for the next tee?

And did he do so after they were no longer on the clock?

I am not defending Crane - in fact I have not done so even once - but as I said, there is a right way to do this and showing up your partner - while certainly entertaining, was not proper, right, sporting nor anything good at all.

It was just another form of look at me grandstanding.  And Rory DOES have a record of that - see the camo pants that the tour had to ask him to stop wearing.

Rory + balls = weenie.

I really dont know the answers seeing that i have never even seen the incident.  And I am not saying that Rory is not a weenie, I am just saying that he was justified in doing what he did to Crane.  I really am quite apathetic towards what Rory does but I dislike Crane and almost every other slow players.

[Jaw2000]

I believe there is a rule that partners must witness each shot taken so that they can attest scores.  He did not do this did he?


Did he hole out and leave for the next tee?

And did he do so after they were no longer on the clock?

I am not defending Crane - in fact I have not done so even once - but as I said, there is a right way to do this and showing up your partner - while certainly entertaining, was not proper, right, sporting nor anything good at all.

It was just another form of look at me grandstanding.  And Rory DOES have a record of that - see the camo pants that the tour had to ask him to stop wearing.

Rory + balls = weenie.

I really dont know the answers seeing that i have never even seen the incident.  And I am not saying that Rory is not a weenie, I am just saying that he was justified in doing what he did to Crane.  I really am quite apathetic towards what Rory does but I dislike Crane and almost every other slow players.

Well we both agree, slow play stinks - but frankly crane is not THE reason for slow play, I'd say Tiger and how he does several things has furthered the issue of slow play more than Cranes mechanics.

Tiger will look at a putt from no less than 4 spots, he'll have stevie walk off distances,  they all mark and remark their balls - it's all gotten out of hand.

Crane has a lot of issues, but nothing was solved from showing him up - welll one thing was exposed though - and that is what a bad sport Rory is.

[DaveT319]

I believe there is a rule that partners must witness each shot taken so that they can attest scores.  He did not do this did he?


Did he hole out and leave for the next tee?

And did he do so after they were no longer on the clock?

I am not defending Crane - in fact I have not done so even once - but as I said, there is a right way to do this and showing up your partner - while certainly entertaining, was not proper, right, sporting nor anything good at all.

It was just another form of look at me grandstanding.  And Rory DOES have a record of that - see the camo pants that the tour had to ask him to stop wearing.

Rory + balls = weenie.

I really dont know the answers seeing that i have never even seen the incident.  And I am not saying that Rory is not a weenie, I am just saying that he was justified in doing what he did to Crane.  I really am quite apathetic towards what Rory does but I dislike Crane and almost every other slow players.

Well we both agree, slow play stinks - but frankly crane is not THE reason for slow play, I'd say Tiger and how he does several things has furthered the issue of slow play more than Cranes mechanics.

Tiger will look at a putt from no less than 4 spots, he'll have stevie walk off distances,  they all mark and remark their balls - it's all gotten out of hand.

Crane has a lot of issues, but nothing was solved from showing him up - welll one thing was exposed though - and that is what a bad sport Rory is.

Actually, something WAS solved - Ben publicly admitted that he plays too slow and said he would try to do better. I don't know if he has, but I haven't heard about him playing excessively slow since then.

I agree that it maybe wasn't the best way to handle it, but Rory did bring the problem front and center in a big way. Now the Tour needs to step in and do something on their end to speed things up a bit. Not saying they need to play in 4 hours, but 6 is rediculous. The Tour really needs to take a stand.

Dave

[pd22]

The tour needs players like Rory who are not afraid to be a showman.  They relish it (Ian Poulter, Charles Howell, Any of the Swedes, etc)
They don't need Jack=Arses either though.  But, sometimes players lose their cool.  it happens.  Tommy Bolt, Pat Perez for example.  Because they are mad at themselves we say "tisk-tisk" and "shame" but that's it.  But because Rory got upset with another player for his actions it makes him inconsiderate, and a jerk.  I DON"T THINK SO.  While his actions may have been ungentlemanly to say the least, it was an emotional tirade.  Ben Crane's slow play was also unsportsmanlike as it did effect his partners....and right where it counts, in the wallet and in the final score.  He, too needs to be more considerate and not just this "I will try" crap.  What if Rory had said "I will try to be better next time"  would we give him another chance?  One clearly violated the rules (Crane) for not playing to speed.  The other (Sabatini) was a bit rude, but within the rules.  
Lest we forget another "Hot head" who is the darling of the Tour....El Tigre.  Didn't he do what I would consider much much worse in his putter swipe of the green which affected many many more players.  All we did was say man that was terrible and what a baby.  But here we are weeks later and we are on the Tiger bandwagon again.  

All I am saying is that its all relative and that Players handle their emotions differently.  
Sorry about that.....I will now step down from the soap box.  

[chtw]

pd, you hit the nail on the head.  TW has one of the worst tempers on tour, and if you've ever followed TW at an event you know that what they show on TV isn't even the worst of his temper (besides the putter dragging).  I definitely have a pretty big temper and while I control it much better than I used to, even if I was on national TV I wouldn't change the way I act just because of criticism.

[pd22]

pd, you hit the nail on the head.  TW has one of the worst tempers on tour, and if you've ever followed TW at an event you know that what they show on TV isn't even the worst of his temper (besides the putter dragging).  I definitely have a pretty big temper and while I control it much better than I used to, even if I was on national TV I wouldn't change the way I act just because of criticism.

I didn't like what Rory did anymore than the next guy.  But I will not let that influence how I feel about him as a person either.  He acted rashly in a situation that was going to cost him $$.  Could he have handled it different, sure.  But we have all done things we later look back on and see that it wasn't the best way to do it. 
I like the fact that he is aggressive, brash, cocky.  I don't know if I would like him personnally. 

[JonDot]

Everyone who plays with me knows that I am in no way politically correct when it comes to certain things,nor do I hold my tongue when I have something to say if I take issue with someone's actions.If it where me in that situation the first time I was told that my group had been put on the clock there would have been a little pep talk given to Crane on the T- Box.Something to the effect of "Your not the only one that is going to be penalized by your dragging your feet so pull your head out of your A$$ and get a move on!!"Some people may not agree with me on this but I feel that if someone else's actions are going to directly effect me then I should have the right to let them know how I feel about it.I don't think he should have walked off but I do feel like he should have confronted him about it.

[Jaw2000]

Everyone who plays with me knows that I am in no way politically correct when it comes to certain things,nor do I hold my tongue when I have something to say if I take issue with someone's actions.If it where me in that situation the first time I was told that my group had been put on the clock there would have been a little pep talk given to Crane on the T- Box.Something to the effect of "Your not the only one that is going to be penalized by your dragging your feet so pull your head out of your A$$ and get a move on!!"Some people may not agree with me on this but I feel that if someone else's actions are going to directly effect me then I should have the right to let them know how I feel about it.I don't think he should have walked off but I do feel like he should have confronted him about it.

Can't argue with that.  In fact what I cannot understand is why it did not get carried out as it should have in the first place?!

[pd22]

Everyone who plays with me knows that I am in no way politically correct when it comes to certain things,nor do I hold my tongue when I have something to say if I take issue with someone's actions.If it where me in that situation the first time I was told that my group had been put on the clock there would have been a little pep talk given to Crane on the T- Box.Something to the effect of "Your not the only one that is going to be penalized by your dragging your feet so pull your head out of your A$$ and get a move on!!"Some people may not agree with me on this but I feel that if someone else's actions are going to directly effect me then I should have the right to let them know how I feel about it.I don't think he should have walked off but I do feel like he should have confronted him about it.

100% agree that is the way to handle the situation.  But, let's say that Rory did this on tee number 8.  then again on 10...and on the previous day during their round.  What do you do if the pep talk doesn't work.  There has to be a point where the situation will wear down on Rory as well and will effect his play (and conversely, speeding up will possibly negatively effect Crane as well)
there has to be an impasse at some point.  
I am not defending Rory's actions, merely bringing a different perspective.  

[golfware]

Rory did what every other pga player wanted to do last year to Ben.  He walked away from a player that stood over his ball like he was paralyzed for minutes at a time.  It is excruciatingly painful to watch Ben Crane play golf and many PGA players actually thanked Rory for what he did after it happened.
When 1 player in the group is slow they all get put on the clock and His group was on the clock all day.
It is a $20,000 fine for 10 clock violations.

 OK, so maybe you shouldn't leave your playing partner and stroll onto the next hole. But anyone who has suffered through 5½-hour rounds at the local muni on a Saturday can certainly sympathize with being stuck with the notoriously slow Crane.

It didn't help that Sabbatini had already been paired with Crane on Thursday and Friday, then found himself in the group behind him Saturday. This is a guy who, in Las Vegas a few years ago, actually pulled out his yardage book and studied the contours sketched in it before putting.

''I need to work on picking it up,'' Crane admitted.

He does, and he's not alone. The tour is full of players who aren't much quicker. And, if walking off on your playing partner is a breach of etiquette, playing at a snail's pace is even worse.

Look at the USGA rulebook and there's almost an entire page devoted to the proper pace of play. ''Play at a good pace and keep up,'' one blue headline reads. ''Be ready to play,'' says another.

''At the end of the day, slow play is the bane of the game,'' USGA executive director David Fay said.

Ultimately, the responsibility for slow play rests with the PGA Tour, which talks a good game but seldom does anything about it. Players are put on the clock and warned if they get behind, with the vague threat of a possible fine if they do it too much.

But, as Allem once said, that's like a highway patrolman pulling a car over for doing 100 mph and telling the driver he'll be watching him the next three miles and give him a ticket if he does it again.

Want to get tough with players? Start passing out two-stroke penalties every time a group falls too far behind. Make them finish under a certain time or add a stroke to their score for every 15 minutes they go over.

The trickle-down effect would be immediate. Players would stop reading putts from 14 different directions, stop taking repeated practice swings, and stop throwing grass in the air to see if the wind has changed in the last 10 seconds.

Even better for golf, the guys in the foursome in front of you at your favorite course might stop doing the same things.

VERY well said!

Kudos to you.   

[Rob]

I agree that Crane was waaay too slow.  However, the group had been put on and off the clock during the day AND they were not on the clock when Rory walked off.   And if he was doing it too show Crane a lesson, why wait till towards the end of the round?  One reason - he's a jerk.

He waited to the end of the round because that's when he couldn't take it anymore. He tried to be polite, he tried to put up with it for most of the round. But there's only so much a person can take, and apparently that's when Rory reached his limit.

The reason I'm defending him and feel what he did was ok is because in an amateur event last year, one of the guys in my 4-some during qualifying was so slow that we got put on the clock, and told if we didn't speed up it would be a 2-stroke penalty for the whole group, and after that we'd be DQ'ed. He sped up - until right after the official told us that we had caught up and were off the clock. Then he slowed down again. The three of us were pissed that he could potentially cost us a spot in the tournament, and kept trying to push him along. And in talking with other since then, they have all complained about this guy. If I'd have had the balls Rory had, I would have done the same thing.

Just because these guys are playing for a lot of money doesn't mean that they need to take 5 minutes deciding how to play their next shot, and then another 30 seconds over that ball. Get your distance, decide on the shot, and pull the trigger. Slow play is inexcusable.

Dave

I totally agree that slow play is inexcusable.  The only thing more inexcusable is breach of golf tradition and etiquitte that Rory demonstrated.   There are certain unwritten laws that are just common courtesy, these are to be kept at all costs.  What Rory did was the same as if someone had a 25 ft putt and he stomped up and down in the line from the ball to the cup and back.  It is not an actual rule not to step on someone's line but just common courtesy.

[pd22]

I totally agree that slow play is inexcusable.  The only thing more inexcusable is breach of golf tradition and etiquitte that Rory demonstrated.   There are certain unwritten laws that are just common courtesy, these are to be kept at all costs.  What Rory did was the same as if someone had a 25 ft putt and he stomped up and down in the line from the ball to the cup and back.  It is not an actual rule not to step on someone's line but just common courtesy.
[/quote]
Well said, and I see your point.  while it may not be in the rules, it is "in" the rules. 

[Atrail]

Rory lives in Southlake down here in Texas last I heard. I give him a pass just for that I guess...

[XtremeCruiser]

3 days of watching this would make anyone snap

Ben Crane's PreShot Routine

Ben Crane's PreShot Routine

30 Seconds

[Jaw2000]

3 days of watching this would make anyone snap

Ben Crane's PreShot Routine

Ben Crane's PreShot Routine
30 Seconds

Current or Sabbatini era?

I have no problem with what Rory wanted to do, just how he decided to do it. 

[Dr.Green]

3 days of watching this would make anyone snap

Ben Crane's PreShot Routine

Ben Crane's PreShot Routine
30 Seconds

Painful! 

[abraves10]

3 days of watching this would make anyone snap

Ben Crane's PreShot Routine

Ben Crane's PreShot Routine
30 Seconds

Watching it once was more than enough for me, that is absurd!

There is a kid on my golf team that has a routine that is about 20 seconds and I feel like killing him everytime I play

[luckysevens777]

I'm glad he mis-hit that ball...

-Lucky7

[Royce Aube]

I personally had Ben's problem. I would take 30 + seconds to hit the ball, my last name is Aube and my playing partners started calling me slow-be and I got the hint after a while and speeded up my swing. I wounder if any of the tour players have a nick name for Ben. Also didn't Sergio have that problem

[TerdFerguson]

Sorry for not taking the time to read all the posts in this thread but  I just wanted to add my $.02 that Rory is a tool.  I can't stand the clothes he wears and I hate that Nike sponsors him.    I'll give him credit that he has been on fire lately but I'll always wish failure on him and this is well before his outburst with Crane.

[snakum]

I don't really have an opinion of Rory, but I do wonder ...

Where are the guy's shoulders?  Is he part lizard or somthing?  If he didn't walk with his little arms bowed out, his shirts would slide right down to his feets.