Can you play as well with the old stuff?

[rp]

I honestly think that I can score just as well with older equipment. Anyone else think along these lines. I would be willing to bet I could shoot the same score with equipment made before 1990, not counting the ball, because that would not be possible to find.

RP

[br61]

I honestly think that I can score just as well with older equipment. Anyone else think along these lines. I would be willing to bet I could shoot the same score with equipment made before 1990, not counting the ball, because that would not be possible to find.

RP

I think I have some balls from 1980's that I can let you use. You probably would spin the crap out of it.

There's one set from 1980's that comes to my mind that is just as good as today's clubs, Ping Eye 2 irons.

[siteseer2]

Nope... proof's in the pudding-- or the tour guys would have Mac persimmon drivers, Dynapower wedges, and Staff irons in their bags

[IMAGOLFER]

I can remeber when I thought Callaway's BIGGEST BIG BERTHA was the biggest driver out there and I thought there was NO way I would ever play with a driver that big. UM...it's 290 cc

[tarheelgolfer15]

I went real old school the other day and putted with an old spalding total blade putter [smiley=grin2.gif]. I actually putted alright, had 30 putts. The funny thing is the putter was older than me.

[eudaman]

the woods and balls of today are far superior...but as far as non hybrid higher irons go, old school just as good and sometimes better.

[rp]

Nope... proof's in the pudding-- or the tour guys would have Mac persimmon drivers, Dynapower wedges, and Staff irons in their bags

I bet if they were not paid a single dime to play equipment, there would be some of it still around.

[champx2]

A forged blade is still pretty much a forged blade. Allthough my 67 vip are not nearly as easy to hit as my mp-33 or 690 mb.

Woods are another story. I have a torn rotator cuff and cannot get the club back much past 3/4 if that. My Cleveland launcher 3 wood is so ridiculously long it is a joke. Not even close to a fair fight. I would guess an equally well hit persimmon driver would be at least 20 yards short of my 3 wood

Drivers are even longer obviously. I hit a couple laughers yesterday. No way Hank Keune or Daly could hit a persimmon that far and straight. And I am hurt. Nowhere near 100%. Technology has changed the game and I'm not sure it is a good thing.

You might see a pro with older blades if there was no money involves but no chance on the woods. Putter age is not an issue. I have a 1968 KCo anser that is as good or better than anything newer.

[mosesgolf]

My buddy and I had a retro round.  We had to use our old persimmon drivers, blades and a Titleist Balata ball(had a sleeve left over from back in the day).  No, I can't score as well w/ the old stuff.  No way no how.  On a long par 4 that I usually have 7-9 into w/ the modern stuff, I had 3 iron.  Par 5's that I have no problem reaching in two w/ a long iron w/ the new equipment had me hitting a 3 wood and lucky if i got there.   This is the stuff I used in the 80's and I must say that it's a whole different ball game.  Reaching any par 5 in two back then was quite an accomplishment.  Now it's no big deal.   But man oh man, hitting a balata ball w/ a persimmon driver is quite orgasmic.    [smiley=grin2.gif]

[Mollinswood_lofts]

Could be your game has went to pot using soup can drivers and tennish racquet sized irons.

Me, I ain't scoring any better than 18 years ago with the new shit!  Probably worse! 

[rp]

If anyone has a sleeve of old balatas to donate, I would accept the challenge and report my findings.

RP

[NRJyzr]

Trying to play with older wound balls now isn't a fair comparison.  They lose so much more with passing time compared to the solid core balls that a large part of the distance lost playing a retro round with them will be due to this degrading.  I suppose if you play with the modern clubs and older balls, also, then it might be fair. 

I used to be longer with short irons using the Maxfli Elite, for example, but using one I had left over from the $8/doz Elite blowout, I lost a ton of distance compared to using it earlier.

The best one can do if one insists on playing a wound ball is to try finding Maxfli solid core wound stuff or the Srixon HiBridTour.

Otherwise, I think one should just grab whatever ball of today and go out with persimmon.  On quality shots, I think folks might be surprised how far they're hitting the ball, you don't lose as much to a comparatively shafted Ti driver as you might think.  It's the mishits that kill you.

Taking oldskool woods out of the equation, I've long tested the "CB vs Blade" iron theory with my own game.  What I've found is that it really makes little difference, and I may actually be slightly better off with the blades; my scores are ever so slightly better with them.  My misses tend to be more catastrophic in nature and can't be helped by any club. 

Earlier this year, I played with a buddy who had Maxfli A10s.  We came to a par 3, I hit the Golden Ram 5 iron and A10 6 iron (same lofts) on successive shots.  Managed to have the same brutally bad toe hit with each.    They were within a few yards of each other, and the Ram shot was actually a yard or two longer.  So much for the fabled cavity forgiveness.  LOL

[luckysevens777]

Trying to play with older wound balls now isn't a fair comparison.  They lose so much more with passing time compared to the solid core balls that a large part of the distance lost playing a retro round with them will be due to this degrading.  I suppose if you play with the modern clubs and older balls, also, then it might be fair. 

I used to be longer with short irons using the Maxfli Elite, for example, but using one I had left over from the $8/doz Elite blowout, I lost a ton of distance compared to using it earlier.

The best one can do if one insists on playing a wound ball is to try finding Maxfli solid core wound stuff or the Srixon HiBridTour.

Otherwise, I think one should just grab whatever ball of today and go out with persimmon.  On quality shots, I think folks might be surprised how far they're hitting the ball, you don't lose as much to a comparatively shafted Ti driver as you might think.  It's the mishits that kill you.

Taking oldskool woods out of the equation, I've long tested the "CB vs Blade" iron theory with my own game.  What I've found is that it really makes little difference, and I may actually be slightly better off with the blades; my scores are ever so slightly better with them.  My misses tend to be more catastrophic in nature and can't be helped by any club. 

Earlier this year, I played with a buddy who had Maxfli A10s.  We came to a par 3, I hit the Golden Ram 5 iron and A10 6 iron (same lofts) on successive shots.  Managed to have the same brutally bad toe hit with each.    They were within a few yards of each other, and the Ram shot was actually a yard or two longer.  So much for the fabled cavity forgiveness.  LOL

Haha, I could see where you could shoot the same with old clubs, like on a short course, but if you're playing pga tour quality then you need as much length as possible, that's why everyone plays new clubs lol. Everything has taken so many leaps forward since the 80s. Club faces, backs (cavity and muscle/blade), shafts especially have all gotten so much more advanced. Launch monitors?? Um... don't see lots of those in the 80s

-Lucky7

[NRJyzr]

I'm playing in about 2 hours, thinking of using persimmon on the course for this round, just for kicks.  Played about 6 holes of a practice loop last night with them, and with a crappy swing (couldn't even hit irons straight) I would've scored close to normal.  The real test will be this course today, we usually play from the tips.  Not that long, 6700 yard par 71, but the two of the par 5s are 570+ and the third is 550+, so it'll be a pretty healthy test, i guess. 

Not to mention the 451 yd par 4.  Guess I better hit it on the screws on that hole.  LOL

[luckysevens777]

Oh yea, I forgot I could probably putt better with an old putter

I'm so bad at putting its rediculous... after playing last night that was abundently clear ... I missed 5 birdie putts inside of 10 feet... and shot a 68 (on par 71)... could have been like a 65 or something pretty easily... maybe I should go buy an really old ping

-Lucky7

[NRJyzr]

I'm playing in about 2 hours, thinking of using persimmon on the course for this round, just for kicks.  Played about 6 holes of a practice loop last night with them, and with a crappy swing (couldn't even hit irons straight) I would've scored close to normal.  The real test will be this course today, we usually play from the tips.  Not that long, 6700 yard par 71, but the two of the par 5s are 570+ and the third is 550+, so it'll be a pretty healthy test, i guess. 

I did indeed take the MacGregor M09T Jumbo reissue as my primary driver this morning, and used a Wilson Pro Persimmon 3 wood, going 2-PW Golden Rams.  I'm a 10 index, but I'm really playing like a 14-15 this year.  I didn't feel like I hit the ball all that great, but still managed to shoot what was my second best score of the year so far, an 81 (+10), which included a triple (don't ask).  I wasn't as long as normal, though I found it interesting on what I felt was a not so great shot on the last par 5 on the course (big sweeping hook), I wasn't much short of where I am normally on that hole with a Ti driver.

It has left me intrigued, thinking even more seriously about this Smart Driver....

[cclaeys]

If I took the old clubs out I would have to get some more headcovers. Those of us that played back then remember carrying 1-3-4-5 woods, and only 1 wedge, mine was a Wilson R90 with the brown shaft in it. I still have all those clubs in the basement, this thread makes me wanna try em out. Also have my old trusty Apex PC's down there - including the knife. If you can hit an Apex PC 1 iron off the deck and get any air under it you are a freaking gamer or have a serious swing fault.

[NRJyzr]

Following up my earlier post...

Played league this past Monday, decided after my earlier round I'd keep the persimmons in the bag.  Decided I'd go even farther and bought out the Cleveland Designed By putter.  Right away on the practice green, what struck me as interesting was that I was actually aligning the blade better than I had been lately with the MOI.  On the course, I putted better than I had been lately, though the difference was slight.

Overall, my entire game was junk as I fought the hooks all day.  Ended up with three penalty strokes, and my short game couldn't save me from shooting a miserable 88.  As far as a measuring stick, this was a useless round, LOL.

I'd like to think I was slightly better off than my hook-rounds with the assorted Ti stuff, but I know the "power of suggestion" could easily be at play here. 

Something else I've noticed, these last few rounds with persimmon, I've actually had more fun than with the Ti stuff.  I thought it might be the "new toy" syndrome, but it feels a lot different than that.  Maybe I'm just channelling some long gone 1940s/1950s golfer.  LOL

[rp]

I have just laid down a bet for another admin on this site that I could beat him with hickory shafted clubs at Lake Marion Golf Club in Santee, SC. He has yet to accept, but if he does, we will see if I can play as well with the really old stuff .

RP

[Ping Mike]

[yahoo.gif]I was about to make a simular post on old equipment. I am sure that there will be some who do not share my findings, but I can tell you that the facts speak for themselves. First off I am a sub 4 handicap I strike the ball on the near center of the club face most of the time. I make it a point to play my old Jack Nicklaus 20th anniversary Blades 3-SW, with matching putter and Persimmon woods 1,3,5. at least once a month. ( I play about 20+ rounds a month ) I find that there may be a AT Best ONE stroke per round differance !  The irons have weaker lofts and are small blade type, I tend to select one more club than I usually will play at a given distance.

The persimmon wood driver is shorter 43 1/2" VS 45" in my regular driver. I love the feel of persimmon ! And I have more control with the persimmons.  As for distance...I am about 20 yards less with the persimmon. ( side note.. Jack Nicklaus won the long drive contest at the 1963 Players club champoinship with a 345.6 yard drive ! ) On shell's wonderful World Of Golf I have noted that many of the players hit 300+ yard drives with the old persimmons as well.  My take on this is that moderen day drivers hit the ball longer because they are in fact longer in length
and you may be able to gain a couple of MPH in swing speed at best. The olny other advantage to the moderen driver would be that it is easier to hit ( Bigger sweet spot ).

So what is the differance between modern clubs and old clubs ? Not much.... I believe that higher handicap players would beneifit with all the bigger heads and game improvement irons. As for the pros and low handicap golfers the differance is almost not there as seen in the scoring.
If anything in golf has improved it is teaching the modern golf swing.

[NRJyzr]

On shell's wonderful World Of Golf I have noted that many of the players hit 300+ yard drives with the old persimmons as well.  My take on this is that moderen day drivers hit the ball longer because they are in fact longer in length and you may be able to gain a couple of MPH in swing speed at best. The olny other advantage to the moderen driver would be that it is easier to hit ( Bigger sweet spot ).

This swingspeed effect seems to vary with the golfer.  Four or five years ago, I noticed I swung at 100 mph with a 43" steel shafted club, 104-105 at 44", 108 at 45", and with a 46" club I was able to get 111-113.  Interestingly, I was able to get the 44" club up to 110 if I leaned on it.  I know there are some who see no difference with anything over 44", and some see more difference as they get longer.

These days, I'm at that 113 with a 45" club, and I'm curious if the above still holds true.

To be more topical, I played this past Friday with a Golden Ram 11° persimmon, at 43½" long, which is dangerously close to the 3 woods I've carried in the last couple years, LOL.  Hit 8/14 fwys, one miss was blown thru the dogleg and three others were by a combined total of 10 feet, if that.  It was nearly point and shoot.

On the distance side, I got a great view of how much carry I was getting as the course was extremely wet from a hard rain in the late morning (tee time was 224pm); balls were actually plugging in the fairway on the front nine, lol.  Most of my tee shots were 240 to 250, with a couple at 260something.  So, while I'm shorter, I wasn't all that much so, and a lot of it is likely due to playing too much loft and/or the shorter club.

I may be on to something, as far as my own game goes...

[rp]

The only difference you will see in iron distance is with loft progression. The old pitching wedges were 50* or more and now they are 45* in many sets.

RP

[cclaeys]

The only difference you will see in iron distance is with loft progression. The old pitching wedges were 50* or more and now they are 45* in many sets.

RP

I am not sure I agree with you. Stated loft and dynamic loft are completely different - you know what I mean so I am not going to get into it. I hit a 48* MP33 pitching wedge just as far as a X1 PS 46* pw and most of the time longer - loft doesnt always eqaute to launch. Older irons were awful, they felt like a$$ and were clanky...I cant believe that Nicklaus was a s good as he was with those old macgregors - imagine hitting a freaking 1 iron with any kinda zip with those old dawgs. Dead nuts center of the face isnt easy for anyone that doesnt do this crap for a living...you dime spot an old apex and you are fine, quarter spot it and you are short and right alot...forgiving is great, even if it is millimeters. jme.

[rp]

What I am referring to is the fact that that MP-33 is 3-4* stronger than the old blades. The cavity backs are even stronger. But the cavity backs almost have to be. If they were not stronger, then the good players would just balloon them terribly.

RP

[styxiron]

well i'm still playing old dunlop dp30 authorized pro model with greats results and with the first generation of SC tei3
as for woods i think i cant go back, pull out time to time the 975D but it's not easy.
for balls the newest the best.